tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post8621790038093507328..comments2024-03-23T12:38:46.260+00:00Comments on The History Girls: The Case of the Disappearing Victorian and the New History Curriculum: by Penny DolanMary Hoffmanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06241989732624913706noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-81074798377671679122013-08-08T22:12:14.033+01:002013-08-08T22:12:14.033+01:00I totally agree. I have loved teaching KS2 history...I totally agree. I have loved teaching KS2 history over the past 10 years, Tudors, Victorians, Britain since 1948, WWII, etc etc. How utterly uninspiring are the Anglo Saxons! I clearly remember switching off completely when, aged 11, I was asked to put arrows tracing the paths of Angles Saxons and Jutes. That's the sum total of what I remember because It's meaningless to youngsters - there are no PEOPLE stories! That's where we need to start if we are to get kids interested! Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16304886632824879441noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-52932432600152689702013-07-18T09:03:13.253+01:002013-07-18T09:03:13.253+01:00Yes, Marjorie, these are exactly the kind of regio...Yes, Marjorie, these are exactly the kind of regional museums that I am worried about, as well as smaller places like the set of small museums in Ripon, North Yorkshire. Somehow, I feel that the big London "tourist" museums will be looked after.<br /><br />A.F.Sefton, I didn't know about that English Heritage scheme. I'll cut & paste the link and search out more information. <br /><br />Having seen the rash of ranking headlines yesterday, maybe it's because the benefits of such visits are hard to measure?<br /><br />But I really DO hope that the various museum bodies are stating this case to Mr Gove and his chums before the given date.<br /><br />Thank you for all your comments, everyone. Penny Dolanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16386668303428008498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-79557324411774274812013-07-17T21:23:19.216+01:002013-07-17T21:23:19.216+01:00How sad. I agree that more recent history is easie...How sad. I agree that more recent history is easier for children to identify with, and there is so much available - places such as the Black Country Museum, and even smaller attractions (I recall my sister and brother's trips to the Rural Life Museum in Glastonbury, with smocks to dress up with, and lots of hands-on Victorian kitchen and school implements.<br /><br />I do wish they would trust teachers a little more, to know what works and what doesn't.Marjoriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09234975039675044712noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-77489847466328537282013-07-17T17:55:32.860+01:002013-07-17T17:55:32.860+01:00A very sad state of affairs if things like this cl...A very sad state of affairs if things like this close down. Such a hard time to be either a child or a teacher, nowadays...really good post, Penny!adelehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15826710558292792068noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-57783448981132769422013-07-17T17:31:56.333+01:002013-07-17T17:31:56.333+01:00Although two of my own books deal with Vikings and...Although two of my own books deal with Vikings and the Roman invasion of AD43, I completely agree that the loss of the Victorians is shameful. History pre-1066 is just too far removed from children's experience. Fascinating, but so limited, composed really of a succession of 'tribes' fighting to survive. The history of Britain is radically altered post 1066, when for the first time, England and the English were mapped and quantified. <br />PS For anyone interested, my Roman invasion book, suitable for primary school use, is 'The Mark of Edain'. Pauline Chandlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05260428070144389154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-73090350071230199562013-07-17T16:39:34.943+01:002013-07-17T16:39:34.943+01:00School trips in general are falling. Health and sa...School trips in general are falling. Health and safety, funding, staffing, number-crunching - theyall contribute to the decline. English Hertiage have a scheme where they will pay for transport and entrance fees to sites, but I don't know if they have been taken up. (see here http://ajseftonauthor.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/why-children-have-to-be-put-on-bus.html )<br /><br />It's all very sad.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00335721389507237440noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-49042358912262298352013-07-17T14:58:12.053+01:002013-07-17T14:58:12.053+01:00The possibility is appalling. Thank you for shari...The possibility is appalling. Thank you for sharing this. By the way the tweet was picked up and featured in today's edition of my History Needs You online newspaper: http://ow.ly/n3auMAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-63939765424101011532013-07-17T12:53:42.414+01:002013-07-17T12:53:42.414+01:00I agree with everything that you've said Julie...I agree with everything that you've said Juliette! I hated studying Roman Britain as a child, but loved learning about Ancient Rome, its people and customs. Learning about the Tudors, visiting places associated with them and museums was (and still is) amazing!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00316785674600819933noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-9802571210683765672013-07-17T12:46:34.275+01:002013-07-17T12:46:34.275+01:00Emma, I think the problem with "suggestions&q...Emma, I think the problem with "suggestions" is that they carry less weight within the school curriculum planning than the more emphasised topics, especially when there's a chance that Ofsted might come asking.<br /><br />Jax, I hadn't realised the impact it could have on Kentwell either! I feel that the grown-up love of history is often connected to something "met" as a child, and that the curriculum links - as well as tv programmes - can often encourage the families to re-creations such as those at Kentwell. <br /><br />As for listening to teachers . . ?Penny Dolanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16386668303428008498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-49624161492814063332013-07-17T12:39:52.626+01:002013-07-17T12:39:52.626+01:00This is a really thought-inspiring post, and I hop...This is a really thought-inspiring post, and I hope museums nationwide don't suffer as a result of the curriculum change. The thing I've always loved about history is that it's a story that happens to be true, and losing school trips will inevitably lead to the disengagement of some children who are inspired by their imaginations.A weary travellerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01791793488553744403noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-80112870164957679372013-07-17T12:33:07.252+01:002013-07-17T12:33:07.252+01:00As a Romanist, I'm very worried that this is g...As a Romanist, I'm very worried that this is going to put children off studying the Romans. Roman Britain is an absolutely terrible place to start with Roman history - there's very little evidence, it doesn't make sense without an understanding of ancient Rome as a whole, most of tehe evidence there is, is archaeological, but the ruins aren't very well preserved here. Start with Pompeii and the emperors!<br /><br />I also think there's a reason 'The Tudors' and 'The Victorians' have been curriculum staples for years - they're the most accessible to younger children. And I love living museums, it would be terrible to see them start to close down.Juliettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00203399623895589924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-58031686499494345082013-07-17T11:47:25.135+01:002013-07-17T11:47:25.135+01:00Thanks for a fascinating post, Penny. I think you...Thanks for a fascinating post, Penny. I think you are right that it is probably easier for children to relate to more recent times - the twentieth century and the Victorians - and that there is more on offer that they can go and look at and experience. I hope there may be enough flexibility in the new curriculum - apparently some of it is "suggested" rather than imposed, that teachers will still be able to choose some of these topics.Emma Barneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02718171070716804800noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-13726085683616405812013-07-17T10:45:00.738+01:002013-07-17T10:45:00.738+01:00Such a sad post Penny, and Harriet I wish! Trust t...Such a sad post Penny, and Harriet I wish! Trust teachers? Gove? Not likely!Catherine Johnsonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14610226884546830879noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-34705038385225212652013-07-17T09:45:00.050+01:002013-07-17T09:45:00.050+01:00Wouldn't it be wonderful if teachers were allo...Wouldn't it be wonderful if teachers were allowed to decide for themselves what projects to embark on, so that they could make best use of the local attractions/museums/festivals in their area and continue with relationships (such as with the Slate Museum you mentioned, Penny) that they know from past experience have been fantastically successful. Trust teachers' experience? What a radical idea...H.M. Castorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08716936870601385683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-33834719713641872942013-07-17T09:35:21.440+01:002013-07-17T09:35:21.440+01:00This is so sad! I love all the resources available...This is so sad! I love all the resources available here in the UK for studying so many aspects of history, especially the living history villages, houses, forts, encampments and basement kitchens, not to mention the smaller as well as larger museums. <br /><br />As you say, one of the most worrying aspects is loss of livelihood of those who make the past accessible and vibrant. They don't only inspire children, they inspire US! <br /><br />Thanks for bringing this to our attention, Penny. Caroline Lawrencehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07249424644829463560noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-4856506106875803542013-07-17T09:34:20.316+01:002013-07-17T09:34:20.316+01:00We take part in a grand annual recreation of tudor...We take part in a grand annual recreation of tudor life at kentwell Hall each summer. There are three weeks of it, and the weekdays are for school visits. Hundreds of primary school pupils have dressed up and come for a fantastic day out with us. <br /><br />But we aren't on the primary curriculum any more. Can't help feeling this could be a problem. Jax Blunthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09415759029231313958noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5502671101756463249.post-58589207274644446232013-07-17T08:26:38.208+01:002013-07-17T08:26:38.208+01:00Selfishly, it does sound as though there might be ...Selfishly, it does sound as though there might be an opening for Alfred the Great, about whom I wrote in Warrior King!<br /><br />Seriously, there is so much of this business of changes to the curriculum being imposed from above. I just heard an item on Today about various measures intended to help underprivileged pupils, and the the presenter said earnestly something along the lines of 'But how are we to identify/help these pupils?' Thinking of the school where my niece teaches, whose work with just such children is exemplary, I felt like yelling: 'Ask the ---- teachers!'Sue Purkisshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09084528571944803477noreply@blogger.com